Vested Capital
Vested Capital

Episode · 1 year ago

(VCM2): Advice For New Entrepreneurs, Nick's Latest Property Investment, Yaro Invests In ConvertKit, Mani And Gideon Business Updates

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

In the second episode of the Vested Capital Mastermind, featuring Yaro and his three friends - Nick, Mani and Gideon - we answer a listener question about how to get started as an entrepreneur, Nick talks about his latest property investment, Yaro reveals he had an opportunity to invest ConvertKit and Mani and Gideon share updates from their companies.

... podcast you're listening to right now, though, is actually the mastermind podcast I put on with three of my closest friends, Geteon, nick and manny, all guys who are doing interesting things with their own startups, with their own investment in things like property and cryptocurrencies and other forms of making money. We do the show roughly once a month. This is actually the second episode we've done so far. I'd recommend you go back and look for the first episode of what I called the the mastermind I I think we're going to stick with that name for now. The Best of capital show normally features a guest where I interview them they're a start up founder or someone who's maybe a venture capitalist or property investor, but this show it's really a four way conversation between my friends where we go over what we've been working on for the last number of weeks since we lasted the show. Then we answer questions that you might send in. And, by the way, if you do have a question for us, anything around business or investment, you can always email that in yarrow at Yarrow Dot blog. That's why a Ro Oh, or you can just tweet me. I'm yarrow stark on twitter, send me a message on Instagram, all the social places. Just let me know you'd got a question for us to answer on the vested capital mastermind show and we'll answer it. So we do answer question from Albert, our first ever email question in this episode today. We also talk a little bit about what we worked on with our own projects and we discuss some of the things around investing property, pretty much the usual topics for bested capital in general anyway. But since this is four of us, it's more of a conversation rather than a background story. If you didn't listen to the first episode, that is your chance to learn more about manny, Gideon and nick. So we do not introduce those guys again, since I don't want to be repeating their stories over and over again every time we do the show. So if you're not familiar with my friends, go find the mass to mine episode one. No matter what, though, I think you'll enjoy this because all three of these guys have unique experiences, decades worth of business and investing experience and also working for startups as well. So we have lots of experience to draw on and different perspectives on how we go about things, which I think is the best thing about the shows. We do have the unique view from people who've started a business but also worked for another startup and also, you know, investing in very different ways with very different risk profiles. I do angel investing, the other guys don't. Nick does more property, the other guys are more focused on their businesses. So, anyway, that's enough about the show. You can hear our conversation in just a moment. Once again, though, before I do begin the main podcast, I'd like to introduce you, if it's the first time you've heard about it, to the sponsor of our show, in box donecom, which is my company. So we provide basically a virtual assistant who focuses on email in particular. That's our specialty, that's what we train and hire four we working for all kinds of business owners at the moment, anything from Real Estate to countants to candy store owners, venture capitalists, online coaches, doctors, lawyers, pretty much anyone who has too much email can benefit from what we offer, which is a specially trained person who will step in and manage, clean up and reply to all your messages, including your email your customer support messages, whether that's in email or helped system. We also deal with anything in your social media inboxes. So if you're drowning in linkedin messages, or maybe you're an influencer and you get too many instagram messages, we can step in and handle that for you. We also do admin task that extend beyond the Inbox, so scheduling your calendar, entering data into software, could be task management software, crm software, basically anything you think an executive virtual assistant can do, we do. But we start with email and that's what we really want to break you free, give you time, simplify your life so you can get back to focusing on whatever matters most to you. If...

...that sounds like it's something you need in your life, in your business. In box DONECOM is the place to go. Book a Discovery Call and you get to speak to me. I am the person does the discovery cause for the company right now, so we can talk about whatever your needs are around email and virtual assistants and we can potentially assign one, two or three to help you. Okay, that's enough from me. I'm going to have begin the episode now with my mastermind, getting nick and and Manny. All Right, I'm here with the guys again, getting Nick Manny, thanks for joining me one more time. We're doing around two of our mastermind call. Since no one suggested a name and I haven't come up with him myself, we're just going to get to you to call this the vest the capital mastermind. I love that word, so I think that works for me. So last time we did this I introduced these three guys. I'm not going to introduce them again while they are all doing things around business, investing, living lives. As Nick says, he's the career job guy. The other two have their own businesses. So I thought couple things to cover. First of all, we do have a question that came in from our very first episode from a listener, which I'll read out in a second from Albert, and love to get the opinion and all three guys on that one. But I thought before we do that, let's just do a quick catch up. It's been think about six weeks since we did the first call guy. So what has happened in the last six weeks? And you can take that question however you like, Giddy in your first in my screen so you can answer first well, it's been a good six weeks. We're just entering into a new growth fighs for splash show, which is pretty interesting. That's a different hat to me to where it's not a hat that I that's it's very comfortable for me personally, but it's one that I'm nonetheless sometimes have to wear, although we're just in the process of engaging some growth experts to join us on the team, so that's going to be really interesting. But in the meantime I've just been really shifting gears from a many creation mode to of a leverage mode. So that's been me for the last six weeks. What does that mean getting in? Well, for me, I think that comes down to three things in business that you need for success. You need energy, and you can get from any different sources, and it's not just physical energy. This money energy, for example, as well the people energy. There's lots of different energy, essentially in just their war materials that you put into your system right to make it work. Then the system consists of two more components. One is value creation and then second part of leveraging of that value. So energy. Use the energy to create value, and then once you got value, you you leverage that value and so for me that the value creation, is where I shine. I love creating things, and that's whether it's product creation or creating systems or figuring out what it is that customers or clients want. They're all part of the value creation, right. And then the liverage is is really the marketing functions, historically, and the business setting. So that's really it. Yeah, so from that you know when you when you get it all right, when you get all the parts of line, you get you get success. So that's that's the theory anyway. MMM, very, very high level. All right. Moving on, Nick, what have you been up to for six weeks? It's so much easy to get to answer this question. Second because guildy and just like sparked off so many good ideas, I've been doing three things. I've been training for a marathon like a crazy person, and then, unfortunately I got injured two weeks ago, which is now really frustrating me because the marathon is coming up fast, at the end of August. So I've got now this closing window of chasing recovery and trying to get back into things without do doing more damage and wanting to make sure that come race day I am fit as a fiddle. So they say, what did you do nick? What part of you is damaged? I went for a run and without any warning, my calf muscle just decided it was not going to keep going that day. So had to call that one off and went to the authopedy sort of messuse the next day, poked and prodded and I stuck it in a bucket of ice for a week and have slowly been re engaging that muscle. But there's nothing serious. But it's one of those things that you just it takes time to recover and when you've got that date looming, and I was really pushing to perform pretty well for that.

I've been training hard for now, the last four or five months and yeah, to get an injury six weeks before race day is super frustrating, brutal. I've seen a few Olympians pull up with that similar kind of injury right while they're performing and that must be heartbreaking. Yeah, I mean I was set to catch the plane to Tokyo and it just like it all fell apart of the last minute. And you you obviously cut your hair for that aero dynamic speed assist right that's why the haircut changed. For those of you watching on the video, I guess we haven't seen each other like like facetoface for a while then. But no, it was just the back of my head. There's nothing there these days, and I made a three mere manny are going in that direction. So, sadly, and I married. My wife is like, Hey, just a heads up, I'm probably going to go bold one day. She's like, oh, that's fine. It's like, well, sooner or later you're going to need to tell me. It's like you need to shave it back, because otherwise it just looks really bizarre when you've got sort of long hair in front and this is just miserable big board patch at the back. So I went sees it. That's what I tell me. No one sees it on zoom, no one sees it on video conferencing. It's wonderful, yeah, but beyond that I've been traveling again. So right now I'm in northern Idaho and I think actually sort of one of the benefits that I see you like this next wave of covid and recovery there, is that this hybrid working style is now being rolled out. So I have have now sort of a lot of flexibility potentially in terms of where I do my work from it and how I do my work. So we're beginning to explore what that might create force. And beyond that, I've been busy with a little property investment that just closed last week. So I now have a threeplex that we're trying to sort out and get moving on in terms of filling an empty apartment which hasn't had a tenant for a while and addressing some deferred maintenance at the previous owners didn't obviously want to deal with. So chipping away at that. That's been my last six weeks or so, if you want to talk to you about that in a moment. Let's hear from many. First, many, how's your six weeks? Oh, yeah, I've just been hustling on focus blocks and trying to grow that from me there are two hundred members well, from everywhere in the world. That gets where over I have to go. Well, I had to come to India ten days ago to take care of my mom, so that's that. But yeah, even when I'm an India, I'm working on that thing. And Yeah, it's been six weeks. Half Hustle we're two hundred members learning a lot about on boarding Charne, getting people to use the product quickly enough before they forget about it. Our biggest problem right now is people don't even use it before they cancel it. Right like people don't even get around to using it before. They just said, Oh, I didn't use it, so please cancel and we're like, Oh my God. But when we get people to use it their life first, they're like, oh my God, this is the best thing ever. They'll sign up and they'll be like lifetime subside. So it's like a dichotomy of two sides. One is like, as soon as we get people to use it, it's great, but if I can't get them to use it then we'd lost them. So that's where I'm trying to figure out right now. And also, of course, paid acquisition. That's a big part of the puzzle for me. I just increasing our ad spent on facebook, acquiring customers all that stuff, which is quite an ordeal as always. So yeah, I feel like I'm going to ignore your finger for a second. Get in. I all. You want to say something about that? I just I was laughing when you said that many it's almost like you need focus blocks to get people to use focus blocks. But I do wonder, you know, you've got a two types of people there. I wonder if the people who are never trying it are ultimate just the wrong target market, or is it a case of something you do with the on boarding that actually gets them to take that first step and thus become users? But it's a tough question to answer. Yeah, that's a tough one and sometimes I feel like we get people because it's a great deal and they are like, Oh, okay, great deal, seven dollars trial for the first month, I'll do it just because, but then they don't even get around to using it. But the people who we get are the real users. They are the ones who are like, Oh my God, I love it,...

...doesn't life changing, I'm going to share it with my friends, and so it's a very interesting situation. Like on boarding, we've improved a lart because if you really wanted to use it, like as soon as you press your credit card button to buy the next page itself is a place where you can go and schedule your focus box and start using it right away, not even like later. So we're trying to improve that part. But yeah, I don't know now. I'm still playing around with that side of things. I get you and I feel like you want to say something, so you want to put in. Yeah, I was trying to figure out where I read about this. Where the rest in growth hacking or hooked, where it talked about exactly that. You know, because we have the same sort of we add the same issue and still still do, but we've improved it with getting people to actually try a product before they cancel, right, because once you once you get them to try, they're much more likely to actually stay, especially if it's it's a targeted sort of audience. And I think it was in growth hacking. Talks about moving the point at which your client, your your user, gets the Aha moment of using or potentially using a product. So an archives previous two. About a month ago, we require people to give us the credit card details to go on a free trial, and so it's quite a big barrier before people could try it and get the Ahar moment. So then we changed that about a month or two ago to no credit card option, but you still have to give your name and email address. So they still a barrier, but now it's much less. So more people are not getting in and some more people are getting to the Ahamamu. Oh, now I see how it works and now I see the benefits. So the ideas that they know, once they get the AH moment for you, your product and what it is and how can make their life better, then you gonna be much more likely to keep on using it. But yeah, bringing that forward, that's the whole idea. So I don't know how, if there is a way that you can do that. I haven't looked at your process, but that might be an idea in there for you. You're absolutely right. This is so funny because only last night I instituted this new change, because now I am running like a major split test going on where one half of the traffic is being sent to a page where it's a seven day trial, but you had to put in your credit card. Another is a totally completely free trial, no credit card require. It says on the page, no credit card required, and I'm going to see what happens. So this is like over a period of a month. I will be able to gather there some stats as to what's happens in this scenario. But exactly what you said was on my mind. I was like yeah, I need to figure out a way to get people to use it. That's all I need, because if I can get someone to use it, they almost like I have users who tried it and used it in India and now the problem is they can't pay for some reason. Their credit cards don't work with our payment system, Blah Blah, with rife card, and they literally like keep hustling me. They're like hey, what can I do? Can you please do this? Can Use give me your bank account details to you know, so I can send you the payment and this and that. So we get all sorts of things like that. But at the same time I have the other side just like can't get them to use it. So yeah, I feel like if I can just get them to use it for free, that's enough of a victory for us, because once you get them to use it for free, the cool thing is, yeah, you can try it for free. Nobody can go and created by themselves. Yeah, of course they can, but like to build a seven operation for this. That's going to take them forever to do that. So if they get hooked, they have to come to us. It's funny. I've just listen to a podcast manny that was the founder of fit pod. It's an APP for weight training exercises. They have about two hundred and thirty thousand plus users and the founder was saying they went through four iterations of their on boarding process. They just constantly change it, and one thing I thought really stood out was a big part of that was actually the founders getting on phone calls with the users, like both ends, the people who were lifetime love it and the people who turned they just wanted to hear everything they could from users directly as possible. But I can see a lot of head nodding there for many so excited to do something like that. But let's let's move on because I do feel like we got a lot of cover still. I want to make sure we answer alberts question, since he was he or she. I'm pretty sure it's he being never know was gracious enough to be our first ever email sender. Innerer,...

...not sure what to call that, and I'll just share my screen for those who get to watch some videos so you'll be able to read along with me. So it's a bit of a long one, so please bear with me. Everyone listening and I'll just going to read out most of it so Albert asks. Okay, on a future episode, I appreciate if you and your group could discuss some ideas or actual steps people like me can take to start their entrepreneurial journey. I currently have a full time job and plan and to transition into a life when I can be a full time business or business as owner and quit working for my current company. Are there any great ways for me to start to learn how to become an entrepreneur? Is it possible to find or liable person or group of people with ideas and invest money to buy into a new small business, which would allow me to learn the process from others? Are The small business ideas? I could start from five thou to ten thousand dollars on my own, which would allow me to learn how to run a small business on my own but also not have a life changing amount of money at risk if it fails. So I'm going to maybe stop there and move straight on because there's three or four questions right within that. Basically, Albert's asking new entrepreneur. What do you advise him or her to do? And I'll I'm going to throw a nick because obviously, Nick, you've been in the situation. The full time job first. Well, I just read the rest of the question in case I miss anything. So go ahead and nick. I'm going to probably take a pretty country and view from the rest of these three guys. But I think the job you have right now is a really big asset and if it is a case if you just don't like doing what you're doing, maybe stop by considering finding another job and working in a company or for a person or a team where it's just a better fit. And I think one of perhaps the best ways to learn about the mechanics of running a business is to go and join an early stage start up company. I don't know where how that is in the world or what kind of opportunities are, what kind of companies maybe in that market, but if you join an early stage company, you may have to sort of take an accept a lower salary, but there's certainly still going to pay you and there are so many things that need doing and usually there is a massive shortage of capable people to do it. So if you are simply smart and you work hard and you are able to show that you can do things consistently, a startup can be, I think, a great place to learn the INS and outs of what does it take to run and scale a business? I'm not sure. Sort of from the question I it's difficult to get a sense of alberts whether he's looking for a like a lifestyle outcome to build a small business that's going to give an otherwise like really strong cash flow and create a really good lifestyle, or if you want to go for the moon and build a billion dollar company and end up with the likes of that scale of entrepreneurship. Those are two very different types of businesses to build and I think, depending on which way you want to go, could lead you to join different kinds of teams where you could learn how to do that. But that would be my two sense. It does. There's another sentence in here that says my goals to have a scalable business which won't require me to be the face of the company and allow me to eventually hire people to perform some tasks I perform day one. I'm inferring it it is more lifestyle than, say, venture backed growth company. That would be my interpretation of that, with the goal of obviously building a team, though, so it isn't a one show only kind of business. The mannie I know you left your job to become an ud parte issue. So you've been through this. What how did you go through the process? Well, I had made up my mind that I was going to do this, so, sink or swim, I'm going in. So that was two thousand and fifteen when I left my job and I just had a burning problem, which was book. Some reason at the time and even today, they're not as fun, they're not as engaging, they are not as visual. So I said I like to remember books by creating mind maps up those. So I just started doing it for my own sake. So every business, I've basically two businesses, three. Everything that I've done in business is to basically do it for myself. I have never created...

...a single product that was for someone else. It was only for myself. I was only solving my own problems. Like every single product, every single course I've created was because I was solving my own problem. I was read and summarize a mental toughness books because I wanted to read those. I summarize the protivity books because I want to read those. I created two three productivity courses because I actually was interested in them. And then I started focus blocks because it is for me more than anyone else. That's exactly what I need to stay focused in network done so. To me it was a journey of like finding what it is that I wanted to do. That is a real problem to me, and then going after it in figuring it out as I went. Of course, the problem for a lot of people might be that if you are in a job and you now going to start a business, how do you do the financing and how do you take care of all the cashlow issues and things like that? That is a tough one. I had enough of savings to be able to tie through for the next couple of years while the business was still in the early phases, to get through it. Not everyone has the same liberty and if you don't have their liberty, I would say you start part time in your garage in the mornings in the evenings, spending couple of hours or day, every single day, working on your side hustle until it's gets some traction and then you decide where you take it. But don't put off the idea of starting a business till one day you have that perfect idea and then everything will line up and you will have a business that's not going to work like that. You Start Hustling today, right now, and you start spending hours every day, whatever time you have, your extra time, on whatever crap idea you might think you have or whatever great idea you think you have. Start Hustling there and over time, whether it's a month too, month three months, consistently keep working towards it and hopefully within a few months or a few years you'll get there. So think of start up as a marathon, not a sprint, and take action towards that and not try to sprint it out, because that's just a dangerous recipe for burnout and failure. In some ways, good advice getting in a real love your take on this idea of learning entrepreneurship, whether that is something you can learn, because I get the feeling from the way Albert asked this question it wasn't just about can I start a business, it's how can I learn to be successful at business? So you've obviously been teaching and coaching and went through a phase of I don't know if you called it learning entrepreneurship or not. At any comments on that? Yeah, so I got qualified as an ECTRONIC engineer. said it's full your study that added it and thought I don't want to be an engineer, and then, as a result of that, I did another degree, which was a master and engineering management, and the reason I did that was because it seemed to me to be more on the entrepreneurial side. It ended up actually being more on the management side of things, but nonetheless there were some topics that they were like commercializing technology, sort of topics, you know, which sort of had an entrepreneurial slant to it. There were some entrepreneurial sort of slanted courses in there as well, but that was really nothing in comparison to actually jumping in, taking the plunge, like many did as well, and and just doing it, like learning while you're doing and you know, I would say probably took me about two years to unlearn my employee mindset and to establish a more solid entrepreneurial mindsets, a very different mindset, and it's no right or wrong with any of them, it's just it's a different hat you got to wear and got to get used to wearing it. One key difference, for example, was that when your employee business comes to you, unless your sales version, of course, but in general, if you on the value creation side of it. Business just comes to you. Don't have to worry about it. You know, the funding gets sort looked after, the customers get looked after, whatever. You just do your job right and you get paid raised. As an entrepreneur, especially at the beginning days, sales as a big, big function of that. You got to figure out a way to get clients and customers and pay the bills, and that's a very different mindset to sitting there as an employee, and in my situation anyway, and business coming my way without having to worry about it. But I do think I did be learned a lot faster or a lot the lessons were a lot more real when I actually jumped in and actually just started doing it. Probably more important in terms of learning was...

...mindset, because it's tough being an Entrepreneuri and it there's a stop being anything, I think, but it's I know it is stop being alive. Yeah, you gotta, you got to eat food and sleep, all the sort of stuff. Aff Room. Yeah, but I mean that's not trepreneother thing is that your life is much more unpredictable. As saying employee, where you you know, at least for a certain amount of time, if you got a contract, you know what to expect. As an entrepreneur, you never really know what's going on, what's around the corner. You know you could lose everything the next day for whatever reason. And they say, you know so many different variables. So it's much more unpredictable and for that you need a good mindset. You need to be able to rebound when you fall. You be able to get up multiple times whenever you get knocked over and and that's that's a hundred percent of mindset thing. So that was for me, you know, a lot of self help and self develtlement sort of books and videos or whatever trainings that I that I did on that, which I think was really important. Mindset was. But I want to touch on something as well that that does affect mindset to and that is many touched and nick as well, but the importance of cash low when you're starting out. So I was in the previous position, to lucky position more, to have my wife working while I was starting up with didn't have any money. I think we had tenzero saving or something, but you know, that was really we didn't want to spend that on the business. That would you would have run out really quickly. So while my wife is working, I was figuring this entrepreneur thing out and I couldn't have done it without that. It would have been extremely stressful to start a business without that cashler coming into just pay the bills. So the idea of Nick of working in an actual start up so you can still pay the bills and learn about entrepreneurship at the same time, I think that's genius. Or if you have a beautiful, you know, amazing partner like myself, where they basically pay the bills while you learn, that obviously is incredible to if you can make that where on that one behind really planet. I was lucky. But otherwise, like many, use your own savings or if you can get investment, then you've got the cash flow the otherwise, otherwise it's just too stressful. It's just then you just worry about how you're going to put food on that table tomorrow and you don't think about, you know, how to grow the business properly. So yeah, a great advice, I think, from all three guys. Only thing I'm going to throw in is I've been recently more exposed to, I guess, startups that are going for you know, investment capital and trying to get that billion dollar outcome. And I actually would lean a little bit on nick side for this now because of that, in the sense that you can join an early stage start up, watch how the founders do entrepreneurship and there's your learning of what it takes to basically build a business while getting a secure salary and, if you're early enough, getting shares, which in some ways is like being a founder. Obviously you're not getting that high percentage, but even if you're getting a few percentage points, it can be a lot of money in a my growth start up eventually, you know, three or four years. And I kind of match that with this idea that certain personalities even that idea will be horrible to them. For example, Young Yarrow would not have been okay with that advice. He would have taken a job at an early stay start up and within six months been like I can't stand being told what to do and I hate coming in nine hundred and twenty five and all of this sucks and I want to be control of my time straight away, so I'll take a part time job, you know, make my bills, working four hours a day or whatever it is. is to survive and you know, live with your parents maybe not an option for you right now. Albert Theah, the need savings. You live with your parents, you know a wife or husband is going to pay your way. If not, you know, basically those are your options. So yeah, I actually think of your personality matches up. Nick's advice. Is actually a great place to start, and then you can start your own business once you've done a good two or three or four years in an early stage start up and see what that's like. So or you might just stay there and decide you don't want entrepreneurship is not for you. It's very much a personality choice. I see nick has finger up. Nick, Buddy, and please I want to do a follow up question, Servis. I think we've done a quick lap on this, but to ask you what do you think is the most important skill to learn, like...

...getting and just talked about mindset, and that's something I think you need to be developing constantly. But when you are building a start up you've got to wear every hat. You've got to be the market the salesperson. You've got to work out what you're going to sell, who you're going to sell it to. You got to work out how to keep track of the finances, you got to keep an eye on why am I doing everything? That's like legally buttoned up. You've got to be the sea or you've got to be the support person. Like, out of all the hats, which one is most important? At the start? You directing that a mean nick. Okay, yeah, I mean, I'm actually going to agree with Gideon and and probably manny to. We all think mindset is sort of like the origin story of all the skill sets. You know, without the mindset, those skill sets don't get developed because you give up or you just don't see the path forward. So the funny thing is you tell someone that and it doesn't seem like the answer. You know, you think it's, Oh, how do I get another lead, or how do I get another product that sells better or, you know, just an idea, but really those things are part of the marathon, as Manny said, and you just need to keep adjusting along the way. But if you feel so depressed because your first thing failed or you know you're not getting any opt ins to your email list or no investor wants to pay attention to you, whatever the negative things that will inevitably hit you and that means you give up. That's a mindset issue. You know, that's a problem needs to be fixed with inside you first. So I wish that was advice more beginning entrepreneurs really took to heart. But unfortunately a lot of people think it's just about finding that secret sauce or that you know, formula that successful entrepreneurs know like getting and many and myself, we know something other people don't. That's why we succeed. But that's that's really not the case. I don't think many. Please button. Yeah, so I feel like one of the biggest challenges and one of the biggest things that aren't we need to learn as entrepreneurs is or not learn. But it actually just is part of the it's right of the passage, which is a sense of commitment to the cause. So until you're committed, you will always find a way out. Until you're committed to that idea, that thing, or maybe it's just the idea that I will do business or I will die without at right or until you're committed to making something work, there's always things you think you need to know or you don't have or there's funding that's not coming or this idea of you know, without commitment things just don't work. So the biggest challenge in entrepreneurship is whether you're committed or not. Are you committed to making this work? Because if you're committed to making it work, everything will come. But if you're not committed to making it work, every marketing skill, every sales skill, every thing, mental toughness, productivity, like we you can learn all the mindset, but that commitment peace. Without it nothing really clicks. It just feels like a constant, never ending chore to get that business off the ground. But when you say I will die with this and make this happen, or you know metaphorically you will die with it, you start to make it work. So I feel like commitment is the most important or most underrated. It's not even a skill, but it's the stepping stone to play the game of entrepreneurship. Yeah, that's a character trivia. Okay. Well, lesson also wants to throw in any last words. I just want to say thanks to Albert, but getting and go for it. Yeah, I actually just want to echo what many is saying. That's a true if I look back when I started, I think one of the key reasons why I kept on, God going, was because I had my back against the wall. I literally burned all my ships when, because I, you know, I went from having a relatively cushy job in New Zealand and a good qualification to emigrating to a new country where I couldn't find the job, no one wanted to employ me and essentially I'd no contacts in Australia to work. So I had to make my business work. I didn't have a choice. So metaphorically burned the ships, so to speak, which automatically MDE be committed. You know, that was that's just an automatic outcome of that. So I didn't necessarily need to read any mindset books for that. So that's a really good point. The other thing I just want to quickly...

...mention in the directly answers next question, which is something that I wish I had learned earlier on. I'm a little bit in two minds about it, but I do still wish I learned it earlier on, and that is I learnt this from while both you are and also, you know, more recently, from strategic profits. What's his name? Richer friends, Eliban for no dons. Let's looking so sure, did you coach it? Street to Strategicut? Sorry, yeah, coach Elivan, then Sullivan. So he talks about first, who then what? What? I sorry, who not? How sorry? He talks about that. That's Jim Collins talks about first, who not one. So similar sort of thread there. I you know, first when you come across a problem, any problem, instead of your first going, as an entrepreneur, how do I solve this, you ask the question who can solve this for me? So on paper that sounds really good. In practice, though, the trouble that I always have going back in times, like back in time, if I got back to younger Gideon as begin a startup, if I had that approach, would have been amazing. I think it would have been much further hit. But then again I'd go, well, how would I pay these people? You know, if I didn't ever a solid business like now. It's not easier now that we've got good cash flow, to go when a problem comes up. Instead of me going how do I figure this out? How do I did this myself, I go who can do this for us? And then we just hire them. You know, it was high the right person much, much faster progress than me trying to learn a new skill or trying to figure it out. But yeah, the show I have is like right at the beginning and there's no when you don't have money coming in, like how do you make that work other than doing a partnership or equity share it type of thing or some other kind of crazy thing that will probably come by you back and later down the track. So I've know if you guys have any insights on that. Well, let's move on. I think we've given Albert too much to think about possibly here. But Albert, thank you so much for sending any question and anyone else listening in now on our second episode of this mastermind call, if you do have a question, send an email. Any of my email addresses, yarrow at Yar or doublog will get to me and we're happy to answer on the the live mastermind podcast. So and no question is to beginners or to advance. Will maybe to advance, but we'll do our best answer anyway. Guys. So I didn't even cover my last six weeks and I actually want to get your thoughts on one particular decision I had to make from your three different perspectives, which I'm sure we'll be very different. So I had Nathan Barry on my podcast, the founder of convert Kit, which I think at least two of you I'm not sure Nick, could you be familiar with them? But it's an email marketing platform similar to an a webber or mail chimp, something like that. Started think in two thousand and twelve. Anyway, just had some rapid growth, very much driven by the blogging space, and they are well to things happen. So I heard from another podcast that they're actually selling shares on the secondary market and what that means is basically they have a lot of early employees in the company who want to get liquidation of some of their equity and other investors will step in and purchase those shares at evaluation of what the company is currently value. that. So the great thing about you don't yes, so this is the one thing about convert K it and and Nathan Barry Super Transparent about absolutely everything with their company. So in fact you can go to I think it's bear metrics, to convert it to common roough. You guys won't even just bring it up right now. It's a dashboard showing you every single detail about the revenue that the company is doing. Last time I checked, it's about twenty eight million dollars a year in run rate. Phenomenal growth. I remember first hearing about them when they were hitting their first million and then they got two eight million, which was already massive, and, you know, just growing, growing, growing. Their valuation for the secondary raise is two hundred million dollars, which is about a seven x times their run rate. Damn, I counter just thinks you did. I'm planted right before you set it. You did it the other I didn't realize. This thing's on the chower room now. Okay, here we go. It's going to prove this right now. Okay, doing really nice, manny. You Win Prize. Yeah. So, basically, well, two things happen. I thought, Hey, I want to get Nathan on...

...the PODCAST, so I did, and then that offously came mean opportunity to talk to him about the secondary rage because I was like I might want to throw a little bit of money in. Now. I should give context. I've basically run out of liquid investment capital, so I'm like this is an either or decision. For example, I have a certain amount of money invested in some stocks, one in particular. I have some money in hair beingb and it's kind of been doing not a lot, and I just made this thought process what I would like to sell half my air being beast shares and put it into something like convert kid instead, and I think that's a nice place to hold it, because that's really where I was making decision. I don't want to throw that back at you three guys. Obviously don't directly answer at comparing air being be to convert kit. Obviously that's a company floated on the stock market worth almost a hundred billion dollars versus a series be maybe level start up, and that's about a two hundred million. But potential for growth in a startup is usually bigger than a company that big, except for a few of the really big superstars like the facebook's in the googles and so on. So I'm curious would you guys ever do an investment? I'm talking about like twenty Fivezero. So you know, US dollars is not necessary entire life savings, but maybe for some people it is. In that case you should definitely not do it, but you know, if it's part of your investment strategy. I had, you know, I had about two hundred thousand dollars in shares and I'm like, I could take out twenty five from that instead of put it into convert kit. Does that make sense? So throwing that at you guys. What do you think? I mean, it's such a relative situation right convert kid is in the in the play there where it is entirely possible for it to become a billion dollar company, just like Kuldjabi, click funnels and all of those. They are playing in the same space. Yeah, I'll be building the other company. Really, what's their run right? You know what? I don't know, but it was recently like it was a big news deal. So could job. He was up there. Think if it what is a couple hundred million right now? Thank you. Thank you, fick. Is One billion dollar? E mean like valuation? Or Yeah, yeah, one point two billion, think IFIC. So yeah, they're all playing in the same space, more or less, in the creator market to help creators build a business, or the online marketing space of build a knowledge business and something like that. So I wouldn't be surprised if convert kid gets there too, even though think if because a lot of competition, click funnels has a lot of competition, convert kid has a lot of competition, but there is something about the founder who has a very clear vision, which is what is very appealing about convert kid, because I've had chat with Nathan very as well and he's hungry. Yeah, and he's very convincing and like what he's trying to do. And he was talking about how click funnels was trying to acquire them at one time. This was like a year and a half ago in or talking, and he's like or maybe two years ago, and the idea of an entrepreneur who has a clear vision is very appealing compared to companies where they're just running through different CEOS and founders just trying to figure out a flirting. So yeah, it's very relative, but convert good is one of those businesses that I do believe in because I use it too. So now you two guys. You ever do nick can Gidion, do you ever do this kind of investment or I know probably Nick, you're pretty much throwing it any investment into properties. That accurate now as we speak today. Know So. I mean, like by just a function of working in startups over the years, I have invested in those companies. I've bought equity I've bought shares as part of my employee compensation package. Starts as being issued with options and then you get the option to actually go by a share. When I've exercised lots of options over the years. This is a tricky one and I'm like trying to pick it up on my head. I just want to know if you exited any of those shares yet. Is that happened or no? No, sorry, see there is a bucket there where it's like just it's I liquid and hopefully they'll be a liquidity event around it. So you must have had a secondary opportunities, much like with converkets employees at some point maybe. So this is an interesting topic and it's something that I don't know enough about to go into really a lot of detail. But the secondary market it's always possible, but typically any sale of shares is still going...

...to be required to get bored approval by a company, depending on the way that that company's incorporation documents are written. And the secondary market there's plenty of people and plenty of firms out there that actively invest. So I guess when I think about this opportunities you phrased it, I would first of all, I suppose take convert kit and just put that aside and just say it's any start up, and the way that I would think about it because what is the proportion of my total investments that I feel comfortable having in a really high risk and illiquid investment? And maybe sort of, given the growth that some errors in the market of seeing recently, maybe the stock markets up. So it's all right. Well. Now I've got too much money sitting in the stock market and I feel uncomfortable about that level of risk and I now want to distribute that elsewhere. So I'm going to now effectively rebalance my portfolio and put a bit more money into super high risk, I liquid, early stage startups and reduce my asset allocation in somewhere else, because that's my overall strategy. In terms of whether or not convert kit is a good investment, and again, I don't know what your situation is. I don't know anything about convert kit, but my two ideas on that would be that if you have a relationship with the founder and you want to sort of become a supporter because you want to reinforce that relationship with the founder, I think that's a really smart move, because someone today who's doing twenty million dollars a year and has a company that's worth two hundred million. That's a an incredible and phenomenal achievement. And if a founder can do that once, then that's the kind of person that might do this again and again and again throughout the course of their career. So if you have an opportunity to build a relationship with that person as an investor a day, maybe this company goes well, maybe it doesn't, but if they see that you're willing to bring money to the table, then there's a good chance that you'll have an opportunity to invest again in their next company and the company after that, and potentially at an earlier and earlier stage, where then the outcome that you're going to get is going to be multiplied ten times beyond what you might otherwise see here in terms of a revenue opportunity. And I guess that the final thought that I've got is that the people who do really well in investing in startups know something that most of the market doesn't. So I think either they have some insight into the company or the team or the space, or they just they know where that market trend is going, or they're just spreading their bets so dimly across so many different companies, which is the typical vca strategy, that if one wins and goes a hundred X or a thousand x, that's all they need, and the other ten that don't win, or even fifty that don't win, you know what, at the end of the day it doesn't matter. Yeah, spot on. Nick you just triggered so many thoughtsless sort of Gideon, and I don't know if you have anything that add to this for a ramble on now I think it's yeah, well said. I guess I'm more of a hey jog and I prefer being focused with my resources and at this stage of the game it's focused on on the business that I'm building right now. So, yeah, hit jog versus Fox. Yeah, and Nikki, you really summarize it's, I think, really well the the mindset of angel investing and venture capital investing, that sort of winner mentality. But I'll still relationships about getting into round two or second company, Third Company. Yeah, I mean I haven't had an exit besides our mutual friend car advice with our bors Fola, in terms of you know, an angel type investment in another company before and that was a ten year ride. The opportunity cost of that investment. I would have probably made potentially even more if I just left it in the stock market for those ten years. That being said, there is an element of insider trading, not that it's insider trading at fact I just heard today one of the podcast I listen to the angel investors saying that's what angel investing is. It's legal insider trading because you basically are inside the company, know the founder, you know how things are going. It's higher risk, but you do get this inside into what a company is doing and how it's going. So Nathan is amazing how transparent he is. Even in the podcast he was talking about, and this this got me a little more excited to they're opening up in the near future like a strike type function for their user base. So they'll provide the transaction capability as well as the email newsletter capability. So...

...that's expanding the tool set. But of course, once you have a function like that, you're scraping, you know, a little percentage of every single transaction your userbase does. And if it's integrated within convert Ki, it also makes it much easier to switch on taking payments with them. So that's exciting and looking forward to seeing what happens with that. But yeah, let's move on, guys. I know we've probably got another fifteen or some minutes before we roll up. I keeps poking with property nick. I really and Nick and I had a few chats, messenger chats, in between this call, in the last call. I think it's a great time to ask you this, n because you just close on a deal and I know I can tell even this when I talk to you about this. This is this is kind of like your Hedgehog Investment Strategy, I feel right now. Is it where you're spending your research time, where you're trying to get better, you're learning, and I just love to know just close the Yeld. You want tell us a little bit about that, as much as you're comfortable sharing, and what was the strategy behind that? Sure? So there's a market in the US, a city, rather little rock in Arkansas. That is a place that I've been getting familiar with over the last few years. I've got a really good longtime friend who grew up there and sort of introduced me to that and also introduce me to property investment in the area. He's sort of a couple of years, I guess, ahead of me in this game and I was down there not too long ago and looking for, at the time, what I thought would be single family homes, three bedroom to bathroom. Start at homes, and in the past they've been a really good, easy, I suppose, first level investment because they're not too expensive. You can typically rent them for an amount that's going to pay all the bills and be cash flow positive. But things in the US have been going like kind of crazy the last six months and we looked at a lot of places and all the prices are skyrocket beyond what I was expecting them to be. So we were getting a little bit sort of downhearted and happened to see a listing come up for it was three townhouses, three bedroom, one and a half bathroom town houses, and it was funny because the listing came up and didn't have any information on it. It just said three town houses and there was a price next to it. Didn't even give a street address. It had these terrible photos and one of the fellows had a had like the actual physical like numbering. It was nailed to the front of the House. So I was able to then work out where it was and was like wow, we have an opportunity before everyone else spends the fifteen minutes to go through the photos in minute detail, like I have to work out where this is, and it was at a good price in it was rented. What I think is is below market. So there's an opportunity to bring the revenue up around it as well, and like all right, well, let's try. We hadn't done anything with townhouses before and there was no homeowners association attached to it, so there was no like additional fees to be paid. And Yeah, we've been made an offert the offer got accepted. We were in escrow for two and a half months, which was a month and a half longer than what we expected, and that all wrapped up last week. So now I've I've got to work out how to put a tenant in one of these town houses that is empty, and I've just found out yesterday that I need to put a new roof on all three of them. So I'm now learning about how to get bids for a roof when I'm on the other side of the country, and what it means when someone says, well, you should you. Do you want architectural shingles or do you want three tap shingles? And I'm like, ok, let me falls the riddle. practill see which I want. You Go. Many, many had a question. I was just wondering what's the rent to price ratio or if you want to just share, like how much you've bored for and what, how much are you going to be the rent tort rend right now, on a monthly basis? Cap Rate? Well, cap would be a lot more cat as personality. But the ballpark number that I go in with is I'm looking for something that's going to be cashloid positive, so the amount of money that's left at the end of the month, after the tenant has paid their rent and all the bills have been paid and some money set aside for repairs and maintenance, there's still some left over. And the rental amount I'm looking forward a baseline is the monthly rental is in...

...the ballpark of one percent of the purchase price. So if it's a something that cost a hundred and fifty thousand dollars, the monthly rent being in the vicinity of about fifteen hundred per month. So you're getting there and you're getting the one percent. Yeah, Nice, yeah, let's go nice. Okay, I'm still into property, no matter how badly it treats me. I keep going back. So I actually found a property manager sin through. Last spoke nick and he's been actually pretty solid. So I'm staying in Canada and Montreal for the time being. But who knows that my chains the next next problem that kicks up. Hey, guys, let's wrap this up by doing what we always doing our mass to mind, it's really talk about what we're working on, since you know, we won't speak now for the next episode, for a month, month and a half, whatever it might end up being. A will do it more frequently if we got more to share, but I'd love to know what your focus is on for the next month or even, you know, second half of the year really, and maybe will start with Nick, as nick is a he's got a wife looking for him right now and he might need to leave us. Nick. I mean, other than learning what is involved in replacing a roof and trying to get my head around that. I'm really hopeful that for the next four weeks my leg comes back to full working order and I get out and run a good marathon at the end of the month. And I guess the other big pieces. You just keep putting one foot in front of the other in terms of both my day job and really delivering. Well they're the back half of the year is always the more challenging half because people sort of start getting a little bit tired, they want to take a lot of holidays in September and on August you suddenly start looking and well, are we going to hit our sales targets or are we going to be like grinding out really hard in the last quarter and beyond that? Yeah, just live life. Who So philosophical? Getting and what do you what's I know you're driven for Splash Yeo, Mr Henechog. So what's the next second half of year look like for you? Well, we do them in quarters, so then each quarter we we review what we do. So we don't, you know, we don't go that far ahead. I mean we've got the bigger vision thing, but I mean that doesn't necessarily affect our quarter to quarter decisions. So yeah, for me it's really this quarter is about growth again, and that's why we're hiring in a building that the growth team as opposed to me trying to do it all and hopefully get to a point where I can still create and these the growth function being taken care of. I'm still overseeing the growth function, but I'm not doing it because I just drowes out my energy, you know. So yeah, that's that's it for us for four quarter three. You know, it's growth, sort of a growth wearing the growth hat very much. So yeah, for me this quarter just like get you and I also operating quarters. Must be something an engineering thing. But yeah, I'm just focused on getting focus blocks up to a thousand members, like fingering out ways to hag bad growth, which means, for me, picking the one channel where we will grow the fastest, which is through advertising or anything else, and really cracking that code, because I feel like we've done somewhat or like customer acquisition cost is still pretty high to the point where I'm not happy with it. So figuring out that part over the next couple of months so that we can scale this campaign, scale overall acquisition campaign, mostly through facebook ads. So figuring out all of those different piece of puzzle to scale the Business House the campaign going many like I know you've been really in the thick of it with paid ads, and you saw that, I mean you just for the listeners. Before many kind of pivoted this focus to focus blocks, you were also diving deep into paid advertising to promote essentially your courses and trying to get that cash flow positive, and that obviously allowed you to take that focus and now promote focus blocks instead with your advertising budget. So is it working? Are you losing money? MAKING MONEY? How's the hunting for for eyeballs going? Right? So we're somewhere around hundred dollars, hundred dollar customer poisition cost right now, which isn't really that bad, but then it's still high enough for me...

...to not warrant to push the button on spending like ten grands our day right because it's still pretty expensive to acquire customers at a hundred dollars. I feel some trying to figure out what can we do to lower the cost of acquisition there or increase the average order value and lifetime value on the back end to kind of allow for on that higher customer acquisition cost. So just like what getting and you were talking about earlier, both those hags first of all and giving it away for free and literally acquiring non credit card customers. We probably acquire them and much cheaper. Will also churn them out a lot because they will not pay in the long term. M that experiment. I believe like, as we do it for the next maybe two three weeks, I should get some data. Maybe that is it's like you're you're just trying to crack the code where that one thing really makes sense, like the offer meets the market place a just a perfect sweet spart and it is quite the struggle. It's quite the challenge to get beyond your user base, your Super Fan base, when you'll go into the open market, to get them to believe in you and to get them to buy and use the product. So, yeah, it's funny talking to you about this many because I know Gideon, you've basically been trying to do the same thing really, like you paid acquisition to girl splash show. But and despite your engineering background, you haven't wanted to be the guy in there with your ads all day long trying to get the campaign's running as your main job. Where many I feel like you have been pretty motivated to do that. So it's a problem we also need to solve, though, right and then as that actually getting why, like you said, you write the start this call. You you you're bringing on some growth people that they taking on paid acquisition as well. Yeah, that'll be our first channel to focus on for them. So I've got some stuff that I've set up myself, but I just feel like it hasn't I'm not an expert at it. I don't. I know enough about it to be dangerous, but I don't know enough to to really do a proper job at it and I've just felt that, you know, spending so much time to myself as actually making the rest of the business suffer, and it's not. You can't just scale if your business is not just about scaling, you need to well, at least the way I view it is. It's it's innovation and marketing coming together that creates a great business. That's my view. So they've got a fire at some point when you get into business, when your technology is mature enough and you building a marketing team, I think they got to both fire on full cylinders at the same time and for that you need the people to drive it. So I think you need a specialist in each of those areas to drive it, and I can't be a hedgehog if I'm if I'm trying to do both those things. So, yeah, could you have you cracked? Like, have you acquired customers on pay traffic? You know a certain cost or it's still to be figured out. Yeah, now we have. So we've been doing paid for quite a while now. It's just I haven't been feeling comfortable to scale that to myself because, similar to you, I think our acquisition cost is still too high. I think is actually dropped a lot now with our new funnel. So so it's good timing for us to to start experimenting a lot bigger now. Just goal. Yeah, makes sense, Guy. So on the throw in my two cents from my focus as well. I'm such not a hedgehog right now. Giving you'd be very disappointed with me doing too many things now. You know, it is interesting with Inbox, and obviously my main company right now, Claire has been building the team so much that she's trying to take herself out of the kind of CEO CEO function. So, for example, she used to do all the client calls, which is just like a check in see how the clients going with the service, often a chance to either fix a problem or offer an upgrade to what we ready do. She's hand that that over to one of our team members, Arman. Meanwhile, I've been basically I'm becoming a podcast person, like all I'm doing, if for marketing, is going on podcast. We hide an agency called podcast connections. I spend a good amount of time in June researching podcast agencies. Had about six or seven discovery calls and...

...there's not a lot of differences between them. We ended up hiring that one. I'm going on about seven to eight shows a month at the moment, which anything for that. Seven hundred and fifty a month us some hundred dollars for a show, more or less. Yeah, more or less. They have an interesting system with podcast connections. Should shout out to Raymond here. It's just for those who might be curious. PODCAST CONNECTION DOT Org, podcast connection Dot Org. Yeah, so they have a payment like a pricing model, where they put a value to each podcast, like they basically give you a certain number of credits for your monthly fee and then a show that has, say, two thousand downloads per month will only cost you, say, ten credits. I'm guessing here, where a show that has tenzero downloads for months will cost you fifty credits and they have tears, they call them, like from one to ten. And you know, if you want to get on nothing but high to your shows, you're going to spend your credits. You know, my seven fifty of US fee would go for too high tier shows a month. But when we're getting a mix now, like I'm going on some shows that have less traffic, more traffic, and to be honest, you know their metrics for assessing traffic. I never going to be a hundred percent perfect either. So we don't really know how many downloads are how prolific show might be. Plus, ultimately each show will have a different type of audience. So a low traffic show with the highly targeted audience, even if brings in one customer, it's massive Roi you know, one customer is actually doubling and that's in the first month. Well, and kind of break even, I guess, of the factor and all the costs per month. So month to we're ready making profit if they bring in this one customer a month. But we're not only doing it for a customer position. We're also doing it for SEO benefit, because that's a big part of our sort of long term, twelve, twenty four month strategy is to start ranking better for some of our key search phrases, because we get most of our current new acquisition from organic primarily because of my blog and some blog posts on the invoks done blog as well. So yeah, I'm going on podcast for the next shut I don't know, six months, nonstop, basically. Meanwhile the team is producing some content and we're starting a little bit of a linkedin outreach programmer as well to try and get more customers there. But it's funny, as I was thinking about all this, I this is why I'm saying I'm not a hedgehog. The job I do for inbox done, it's not full time, for sure, it's far from it. And the angel investing, doing this podcast, property investing, each of those things in turn tends to suck a day out of my life, depending on what's demanding time. But, as both you guys know, I have a connection to Ukraine and I just really wanted to potentially do something with the resource I have there in the sense of the people I know. I've been had this idea of the back of my head and I'm like, you know, I could really build an inbox done for Ukrainian development access and having being a startup founder looking for a programmer, a developer, an engineer in the past and knowing how hard that was, the potential to reach Ukrainian development, you know, expertise talent at a potentially lower cost. But even just the fact that I have access to that audience, to relationships there, I could basically build another inbox done company with my partnership with Andre, who's Ukranian friend. So I've been haven't started this yet, but we've been in talks like should we consider starting a basically an inbox done for programmers so we can find, you know, programmers for startup companies? I am excited about the idea because I already know the business model. But it's also a higher demand, higher cost service. So I do feel like if we can actually have the supply side, which is the harder part, the demand will be much, much stronger than for you know, you buck done is great, but it's not like not everyone is just hunting for an email managers the way they are hunting for developers and they're seeing our thanks money. Thank you home, my guys. Thank you for listening all the way through to the end of today's mastermind group podcast number two with my...

...three friends. I hope you enjoyed that. As you can no doubt, how we'd certainly have varying opinions and thoughts, yet a lot of similarities and we especially appreciate the questions from Albert today. So this an invitation for you send the question in as well. We'd love to devote part of every episode to answering at least one question and right now, you know, we're not getting a lot. This is a brand new show, so it's an opportunity to get all four of our perspectives on anything you're working on regarding business startups, investing, whether you're trying to generate some cash flow, whether you're thinking about how to invest your money if you are ready have something saved up, or any aspect of growing your business. We can help, and he's ready heard today different perspectives from all four of us. So we certainly can offer you a varying insight in terms of what we all consider the best way to do something or, you know, give your advice. Basically, of course, we're not experts of everything. We're not offering investment advice, as the legal disclaimer has to go out there, but we'd love to offer help and feedback. So please send in a question of email it to me. Yarrow. Why A ro O at Yarrow? Why A ro O dot blog? Blog? That will get straight to me. Tell me it's a question for the show. We will answer it on the very next episode. And Yeah, would love to help you. And although Albert did not do this, you are certainly welcome to mention your website. An opportunity for you to get in front of my audience as well. So when you ask a questions, say you're from, your domain name, your website, Your Business, and we give that a shout out as well on the show. Okay, so, as I said before, this is a sub show on my best of capital podcast. So when you do subscribe, which I know you're going to do, if you haven't done so already, hit the plus button or the follow button or the subscribe button on your podcast APP. So you get this show every single time we release it, including this the mastermind show, we do roughly once a month. We're going to do it. You always get all of those episodes, plus all the interviews I do on the regular best of capital show with start up founders, with people investing property and stocks and Crypto. Me and my team are working hard to get a new guests all the time and I don't love of doing the show. So you're going to get a continuous stream of episodes going forward. If this is a topic you care about, if you enjoy the style of this show, please share it, please subscribe and especially if you think there's something specific in an episode, something someone says that really resonated with you or you think would resonate with someone important to you and help them get past something or open their eyes to something, please share with them. The more people we can reach with this show, the better it is for everyone. We can have more guests, we can grow and I'd be very grateful. Okay, that's it from me. My name is yarrow and I will speak to you on the very next episode.

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